Kit Kat 5.3 60'/N/T Gollum's Cave Area - requesting info

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Kit Kat 5.3 60'/N/T Gollum's Cave Area - requesting info

Postby Andrew » Tue Apr 15, 2008 7:09 pm

Mike and I am interesting in leading Kit Kat... Anyone who's led it in the last few years... if they could let me know what the real YDS grade is on it? Is it really modern-day 5.3 or harder and how does it protect? Is it 'G' or PG, etc.

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Re: Kit Kat 5.3 60'/N/T Gollum's Cave Area - requesting info

Postby Matt Peck » Tue Apr 15, 2008 10:03 pm

This choss heap is one of the more plausible 5.3-4's in welsford. It takes good medium to large pro, but is often dirty, slimy, and loose. The grade is about right, but the climb may be more committing due to aforementioned dirt, slime, and loseness. I recall it having a comfortable belay stance at the top. You probably won't kill yourself by hitting ledges if you fall, unlike most of the other easy "classics" of this grade.
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Re: Kit Kat 5.3 60'/N/T Gollum's Cave Area - requesting info

Postby Fred » Tue Apr 15, 2008 10:49 pm

doesn't the guidebook say 5.3 G and also give you all the other info you mentioned?

John and I climbed it this winter in our boots. The guidebook description is accurate.
I want to go to hell... there's probably lots of rock to climb there.
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Re: Kit Kat 5.3 60'/N/T Gollum's Cave Area - requesting info

Postby Andrew » Wed Apr 16, 2008 7:05 am

I'll have to look at the new guidebook. I was looking at the 2001 guide.
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Re: Kit Kat 5.3 60'/N/T Gollum's Cave Area - requesting info

Postby martha » Wed Apr 16, 2008 10:47 am

Andrew, you lead 5.7 or 5.8 right? I wouldn't worry about it. I"m 7 months pregnant and I'd still lead Kit Kat, in my boots.... now only if I could get up the trail with a pack on my back..... hehe.

have fun climbing! must say I'm a bit jealous. I won't be out until close to Fall I'm sure!

Cheers.
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Re: Kit Kat 5.3 60'/N/T Gollum's Cave Area - requesting info

Postby mathieu » Wed Apr 16, 2008 12:19 pm

I was guided up this climb by some girl named Martha a few years back, top notch guiding, solid lead on her part. One of Welsford best easy routes. You could climb the whole thing with a handfull of hexes if I remember.
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Re: Kit Kat 5.3 60'/N/T Gollum's Cave Area - requesting info

Postby Andrew » Wed Apr 16, 2008 1:25 pm

Sounds fun then.

I hope I can still climb! I haven't been on rock or plastic since October! :P
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Re: Kit Kat 5.3 60'/N/T Gollum's Cave Area - requesting info

Postby Burley » Wed Apr 16, 2008 1:30 pm

Dude, it is 5.3. That's like...... no... I don't know what that is like, but... no... wait... I think I just peed myself a little.

Ok... I'm dry again and not bustin a gut.

Dude, it is 5.3. Get on it and cruise it with the confidence of a freaking gladiator. I'm sure you can run up a 5.3 off the couch.

If you don't then you need to start aid climbing and get confidence if your gear... or overconfidence... which would be bad. Either way it's going to help you lead head.
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Re: Kit Kat 5.3 60'/N/T Gollum's Cave Area - requesting info

Postby Matt Peck » Wed Apr 16, 2008 6:27 pm

Ditto man. 5.3. My grandma hikes 5.6. In her slippers. You should be able to kill it no prob. Then go send Adventure Pedestre.
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Re: Kit Kat 5.3 60'/N/T Gollum's Cave Area - requesting info

Postby Burley » Thu Apr 17, 2008 7:50 am

Spot on big daddy! Adventure Pedestre should be on everyone's list if they haven't done it. Cool move x 2. But the walk up there... oh I'm lazy.

Andrew,
Jump on something doable that you know can be stitched up. If you feel the need to bail you can just walk around to the top and rap off to get your gear. If that isn't possible aid until you can free the rest. If you don't know how to aid you should learn... good skill to put in the old bag of tricks. Aid is one way to get more confidence in your pro (maybe even overconfidence). Everyone should trust their gear enough to lower off it or aid on it. Obviously if you are going to get lowered off it would be safest to plug in three and make a little anchor... remember.... Solid anchor, Redundant, Equalized, and No Extension.
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Re: Kit Kat 5.3 60'/N/T Gollum's Cave Area - requesting info

Postby mathieu » Thu Apr 17, 2008 1:31 pm

Forget the hexes, just bring some cow bells.

No offence but the only time asking for beta on a 5.3 is allowed is if the route looks like the ones below.
Image
Assiniboine
Image
Mt. Sir Donald NW Ridge. (Left Skyline)
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Re: Kit Kat 5.3 60'/N/T Gollum's Cave Area - requesting info

Postby cory » Thu Apr 17, 2008 1:56 pm

Beta, as requested:
Start with a good fist jam and an edge for your left foot, smearing your right against the tuft of dried grass.
Crank with a bit of a lieback off the jam and reach up to the ledge. Be sure to grab the rock, not the gravel or shurb.
Mantle.
The middle section has two or three options; the left arete is coolest, but the pro is better and rock more solid in the dihedral. The face between the two gets the worst of both worlds. Mantle ledge if you go left or traverse left to ledge if you go right.
The top section you're really better off running out the marginal pro and going straight up, but if you start to brown in your bermudas, move a bit the right to walk up a gully slope or to find a placement and traverse back.
Top out the massive ledge and take a few high steps on broken slab to the large incut dirt pad. BRing a long cordelette to tie off the enormous tree to belay the second.
To descend walk horizontally to the left 10' then down the trail to base of climb.
A tripple set of BD cams in the # .5-2 range, or a couple blue/black tricams and #8-10 nuts and 3 hexes should just about do it.
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Re: Kit Kat 5.3 60'/N/T Gollum's Cave Area - requesting info

Postby martha » Thu Apr 17, 2008 2:15 pm

cory wrote:Beta, as requested:
Start with a good fist jam and an edge for your left foot, smearing your right against the tuft of dried grass.
Crank with a bit of a lieback off the jam and reach up to the ledge. Be sure to grab the rock, not the gravel or shurb.
Mantle.
The middle section has two or three options; the left arete is coolest, but the pro is better and rock more solid in the dihedral. The face between the two gets the worst of both worlds. Mantle ledge if you go left or traverse left to ledge if you go right.
The top section you're really better off running out the marginal pro and going straight up, but if you start to brown in your bermudas, move a bit the right to walk up a gully slope or to find a placement and traverse back.
Top out the massive ledge and take a few high steps on broken slab to the large incut dirt pad. BRing a long cordelette to tie off the enormous tree to belay the second.
To descend walk horizontally to the left 10' then down the trail to base of climb.
A tripple set of BD cams in the # .5-2 range, or a couple blue/black tricams and #8-10 nuts and 3 hexes should just about do it.



HAHAHAHAHAHAH

Thanks for the laugh Cory. I nearly peed my pants.
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Re: Kit Kat 5.3 60'/N/T Gollum's Cave Area - requesting info

Postby Burley » Thu Apr 17, 2008 2:17 pm

Cory's reply = Burley peeing in his pantaloons again
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Re: Kit Kat 5.3 60'/N/T Gollum's Cave Area - requesting info

Postby Andrew » Thu Apr 17, 2008 8:55 pm

*** Paints a BIG HUGE RED TARGET ON CHEST ***


OUCH

I only asked for Beta because alot of the low difficulty rating routes are choss or they are old-school grades.

yes, I've led 5.7 trad and a couple 5.8 trad and a few sport... even a 5.9 and a 5.10 sport .... that wasn't the real intent... it was mainly is it choss, is it fun, does it protect well.

Sounds like it's worthy of climbing and its of easy difficulty even for a 'Grandma', can we all agree?

Haha.

I'm glad I could assist in a good laugh.

Andrew 'the target'
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Re: Kit Kat 5.3 60'/N/T Gollum's Cave Area - requesting info

Postby martha » Thu Apr 17, 2008 9:32 pm

Andrew wrote:


I only asked for Beta because alot of the low difficulty rating routes are choss or they are old-school grades.



In the future, if it is 5.6 or under, you can be sure that it won't be harder than a 5.7... even for old school. And you lead that no problem at all. :)
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Re: Kit Kat 5.3 60'/N/T Gollum's Cave Area - requesting info

Postby Andrew » Fri Apr 18, 2008 6:46 am

Thanks Cara!

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Re: Kit Kat 5.3 60'/N/T Gollum's Cave Area - requesting info

Postby Burley » Fri Apr 18, 2008 7:12 am

I'm sure if a route is a choss heap Fred would tell you in the guide... usually. The "G" should tell you there is some gear.

Get on er big fella!
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Re: Kit Kat 5.3 60'/N/T Gollum's Cave Area - requesting info

Postby Fred » Fri Apr 18, 2008 8:53 am

Burley wrote:I'm sure if a route is a choss heap Fred would tell you in the guide... usually. The "G" should tell you there is some gear.


dido

the guidebook, which I know you own Andrew, provides the accurate grade, adequacy of protection, quality of the route, and often sketch factor if required
I want to go to hell... there's probably lots of rock to climb there.
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Re: Kit Kat 5.3 60'/N/T Gollum's Cave Area - requesting info

Postby martha » Fri Apr 18, 2008 11:16 am

Fred wrote:
the guidebook, which I know you own Andrew, provides the accurate grade, adequacy of protection, quality of the route, and often sketch factor if required


With the exception of one particular route on Upper Tier...... A Mike Fellows special....
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Re: Kit Kat 5.3 60'/N/T Gollum's Cave Area - requesting info

Postby Andrew » Wed Apr 23, 2008 7:35 pm

I need someone to help me sort through my many boxes full of stuff so I can find the new guidebook. ARG! :P

*lol*
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Re: Kit Kat 5.3 60'/N/T Gollum's Cave Area - requesting info

Postby jeremy » Sun Apr 27, 2008 6:25 pm

i think thats the route we solo down climb when doing reindeer land
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Re: Kit Kat 5.3 60'/N/T Gollum's Cave Area - requesting info

Postby Fred » Sun Apr 27, 2008 6:40 pm

no. It's just left of the down solo scramble which I think is actually harder than Kit Kat.
I want to go to hell... there's probably lots of rock to climb there.
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Re: Kit Kat 5.3 60'/N/T Gollum's Cave Area - requesting info

Postby Adam » Mon Apr 28, 2008 2:10 pm

DIDJA SEND!?!?! :shock:
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Re: Kit Kat 5.3 60'/N/T Gollum's Cave Area - requesting info

Postby Shawn B » Wed Apr 30, 2008 1:02 pm

Fred wrote:no. It's just left of the down solo scramble which I think is actually harder than Kit Kat.



Hmmmm...why not just downclimb Reindeer Land itself??? You folks all climb 5.10 right? So you should be able to downclimb a soft 5.5. :wink:

But seriously, I think what comes off to me as elitist posts don't really serve any useful purpose. Would you give the same type of reply if someone was asking for beta on a 5.11? This is a public forum and you would think that it would be a good spot for beginners to ask questions. If I were a beginner and I read these replys, I know I wouldn't feel inclined to ask a question risking being made fun of.

And just to add how I remember not a whole long time ago a certain poster who replied above and who climbs kit kat in their boots (and who at the time could climb 5.10 or harder) wigged out on a 5.5 traderoute in North Conway on second. So just remember your past when posting and don't :oops: yourself or belittle what other people climb or how they climb.
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Re: Kit Kat 5.3 60'/N/T Gollum's Cave Area - requesting info

Postby Matt Peck » Wed Apr 30, 2008 8:55 pm

Ha HA! good call Shawn.
And apologies if needed.
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Re: Kit Kat 5.3 60'/N/T Gollum's Cave Area - requesting info

Postby Andrew » Thu May 01, 2008 6:31 am

you guys are funny.

I don't take offense at anything on here anymore. I know it's just people who are really bored, really want to be climbing and not typing on a computer and are just chomping at the bit to type something :)

Have a break, have a Kit-Kat.

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Re: Kit Kat 5.3 60'/N/T Gollum's Cave Area - requesting info

Postby Burley » Thu May 01, 2008 7:24 am

You are right on with that statement Andrew.

We all like to give each other a hard time... I don't think anyone would do it to a beginner.

I pee my pants on anything that is run out or with crap gear.
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Re: Kit Kat 5.3 60'/N/T Gollum's Cave Area - requesting info

Postby Fred » Thu May 01, 2008 7:36 am

If a guy walks out on the paintball field with a pink dress on it's hard not to open fire... Moraly yes you know you shouldn't but instinctively you just do.
I want to go to hell... there's probably lots of rock to climb there.
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Re: Kit Kat 5.3 60'/N/T Gollum's Cave Area - requesting info

Postby mathieu » Thu May 01, 2008 11:30 am

Fred wrote:If a guy walks out on the paintball field with a pink dress on it's hard not to open fire...


Great analogy Fred, almost as good as "useless as an ashtray on a motorcycle".

Apologies to Andrew of course. If anybody is in Welsford in the next few weeks and sees a truck with Alberta plate, that would be me. I'll be easy to find on the cliff, just listen for the guy scared half way up a 5.6.

Later

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