Anti Trad Climbers

It’s sharp....really sharp!

Moderators: chossmonkey, Dom, granite_grrl, peter, Climb Nova Scotia, Matt Peck

Re: wow

Postby mitchleblanc » Sun Aug 14, 2005 2:11 am

climberwannabe wrote:Wow Mitch, and some of your posts on THIS website made me blush....

I watched that video too, thats awesome man. I've never bouldered before but wholly flowers, that looked hard.


Yeah, that thread was awesome. As for the boulder problem, it is great... it's definitely an awesome climb, and certainly the hardest I've done. Glad you liked the video. Most of the credit goes to my buddy Brendon, he put it together pretty much.
User avatar
mitchleblanc
 
Posts: 342
Joined: Wed Oct 20, 2004 12:37 am
Location: Vancouver

trainin' 'n stuff

Postby climberwannabe » Sun Aug 14, 2005 10:53 am

So Mitch when you talk about training and and gettting better at climbing (by not Trad climibng)... what kind of routine do you have? Is it all climbing, or do you do other physical training?
Mother nature: 1, climberwannabe: 0
User avatar
climberwannabe
 
Posts: 244
Joined: Fri Jan 21, 2005 5:38 am
Location: Greenwood

Postby mitchleblanc » Mon Aug 15, 2005 1:13 am

Ok, though this is off topic now, I would be happy to share my "training". Before I start, some of this is a bit more theoretical than actual.. it's what I would like to be doing ;)

First of all, being fat is the worst thing of all for your climbing, and I have weight to lose, for sure. I used to run until I hurt my knee, and it made a huge difference. People have commented that I actually look skinnier and more ripped, etc. Whether it helps my climbing or not, I am not sure, but common sense says yes. It's not a coincidence that olympic athletes have eating disorders. Being fat means slow and heavy. It takes alot out of you when you are running a lot, unfortunatley. Eric Horst in his book "learn to climb 5.12" or whatever it's called, recommends running (I think) two times a week (or three?) for 30 mins, light, just to eliminate excess uncessary muscle and fat. So I do that. I probably ran too much, but oh well.

I do weights.. I hit the gym quite a bit (ideally) and do lots of exercises.. I do some climbing specific ones like Lat-pulldowns, chin-ups, etc, but mostly I do other stuff like pushing exercises and shoulder exercises, for injury prevention, and legs because I like running. I think, to a certain extent, that all around fitness is pretty important. Again, I'm pretty beefy and I think it probably hinders my climbing to do too much weights.. but I'd rather be too built than injured, and I think that's the tradeoff. Plus I want to look big, and not have a gross un-proportioned body. I want to be Brad Pitt!

For climbing specific training I spend most of my time in the gym doing crimpy routes on mildly overhanging walls.. I don't spend much time on big overhangs because it's useless, even in Sydney (massive overhangs everywhere) it's usually my fingers holding me back. I used to do lots of chin-ups (100 per day, for a while) and other stuff like that, at the UNB gym, but I think chin-ups aren't that useful. Then again, I can do one-arms, so maybe it's just that above a certain level, it's not helpful. Unsure. I rarely do finger board exercices, only because I climb so much outdoors these days. I used to do a bit, but it requires a weight-belt and other stuff, so it's not high on my list. Campusing I used to do a lot, and that probably made a large difference. Contact strength and dynamic power are, I think, two of my strengths, and I think that campusing is great for these. However, in recent times I find that my static strength has suffered, as a result of my "dynamic" style. People who climb much more deliberately (Ghislain?) have much better static lock-off strength.. I mean, big static reaches, etc. So try to climb slow and in control, don't dyno.

I do tons of ab workouts (on the finger board: leg raises, knee raises (to the sides as well), "power knees", where you hold your knees up and get a friend to pull them down, "power leg raises", where your friend pushes your straight legs down while you try to raise them up) and I think this helps your core tension alot, and I know for a fact I can hike my legs up whenever required. My friend Mark told me recentely that he had to train leg raises specifically to do one of his hardest sends.. core strength is key. I can't do many sit-ups though, so I think it's quite specific to climbing. Learn to do sit-ups properly, and use varying leg positions to vary your targetted abs.

Endurance and flexibility are overrated, although I've recently been watching lots of my friends flail because they are just way too stiff.. it's frankly embarassing. Zig was always doing stuff I couldn't do because he was flexible, and I think it can help sometimes. "Froggy" type stretches and being able to heel hook near your nose are particularly important.

So that's my "thoughts on training".. what do I actually do? I climb mostly. Especially now I spend at least 3 or 4 days out per week, often a few in a row, plus nights in the gym (often climbing twice per day), so there's no time for training. Of course, it's the sending season. In winter things are different.

I take lots of rest (unless I'm climbing 3/4 days in a row) before trying my main projects, so that I can actually get stronger (you need to take time off to see gains in strength and tendon strength).

My thoughts on getting better at climbing are very simple: a) Travel lots, b) Hang out with people who are much better than you, and c) Climb things that are above your level. It takes people months of work to do their hardest projects, and recentely, as I have been doing harder stuff, I've found that most of hte really strong climbers I'm meeting aren't any better, just a lot more dedicated and tenacious. I know I was surprised.. try working something for 4 weekends, and see how hard you can climb. I know sometimes I can't even pull off the ground on some problems, or do a single move, in the first weekend, and by the third session I send them!

Wow, this is a long essay. I wish my thesis was this fun to write.

Finally, have a read through some of the training pages written on the UNB rock and ice website. They are pretty corny articles I wrote a long time ago, but contain good information that I took from several (neil gresham, metolius, eric horst) fairly good sources. Mostly common sense.

As far as a routine goes, it's hard.. a 7 day week doesn't really work well. Try to come up with a good 8 or 9 day schedule, I think that is easier. Take two days off ideally before a hard project day, and if you're really campusing/fingerboarding hard, take two days off after and one before, for maximum gain.

Note that I made absolutely no mention of endurance.. because endurance climbing is so dumb: Do laps, endlessly. No thanks!

Last thing: two fun games to improve your footwork and accuracy: Try climbing for an entire night without EVER adjusting your feet. Use the hold exactly how your foot first touches the hold. You'll be amazed. Second game is to try to traverse the entire wall without your friend hearing you. If they hear you (facing away from the wall) then you have to go back and try again. Your footwork will improve. Be accurate with your hands too.

That is all (for now) ;)
User avatar
mitchleblanc
 
Posts: 342
Joined: Wed Oct 20, 2004 12:37 am
Location: Vancouver

Postby Fred » Mon Aug 15, 2005 8:04 am

mitchleblanc wrote:Note that I made absolutely no mention of endurance.. because endurance climbing is so dumb: Do laps, endlessly. No thanks!


I disagree. I think it depends what you are training for. If you plan to do long pumpy sport climbs in places like Red River Gorge Kentuck, I recommend all you do is endurance train. It probably won't let you climb harder projects but you will be able to send routes that at are at your limit one after another. Without endurance training you might only be able to try one hard route then resort to climbing easy stuff all day after that. However, if you are a boulderer then endurance training probably won't help you send harder. Endurance won't make you stronger. But I do think it will let you try that hard problem many more times with the same power without giving up.

I like to do laps at the gym to train for endurance. I guess that makes me dumb :wink: Hey! It works for me.

my 2 cents
I want to go to hell... there's probably lots of rock to climb there.
User avatar
Fred
Site Admin
 
Posts: 3140
Joined: Wed Oct 20, 2004 12:30 am
Location: Fredericton, NB

Postby Scooter » Mon Aug 15, 2005 11:06 am

with the whole endurance thing being dumb, i think he was specifically talking about training for bouldering. which iin some cases it doesn't matter but i find my endurance lacks big time and i get pumped out quickly. endurance helps.
User avatar
Scooter
 
Posts: 952
Joined: Tue Dec 14, 2004 3:38 pm
Location: Halifax, Nova Scotia

Postby dcentral » Mon Aug 15, 2005 12:01 pm

I used to do lots of chin-ups (100 per day, for a while) and other stuff like that, at the UNB gym, but I think chin-ups aren't that useful.


This could also be a quantity vs. quality issue. I'm not commenting on your technique here.

But a 100 in one work out is a lot for most people. If someone can do 20 good ones with no sacrifice in technique ex. swinging from your hips or whatever to get up. Will probably be just as benficial then doing a lot with bad technique.
User avatar
dcentral
 
Posts: 653
Joined: Wed Oct 27, 2004 10:00 pm
Location: Victoria, BC

Postby martha » Mon Aug 15, 2005 2:01 pm

dcentral wrote:
I used to do lots of chin-ups (100 per day, for a while) and other stuff like that, at the UNB gym, but I think chin-ups aren't that useful.


This could also be a quantity vs. quality issue. I'm not commenting on your technique here.

But a 100 in one work out is a lot for most people. If someone can do 20 good ones with no sacrifice in technique ex. swinging from your hips or whatever to get up. Will probably be just as benficial then doing a lot with bad technique.


I assure you..Mitch's chin -ups are text book. all of them, every single time. He is a freek of nature. he did chin ups with my entire body weight hanging around his waist. I've never ever seen him swing, twist or whatever.
The phrase "working mother" is redundant. ~Jane Sellman

If a husband speaks in the woods, and his wife is not there to hear him...is he still wrong?
martha
 
Posts: 2105
Joined: Wed Oct 20, 2004 9:40 am
Location: planning the next climbing trip....

Postby The Teth » Mon Aug 15, 2005 3:08 pm

I was able to do one handed chin-ups after I lost weight on the Tim Hortans diet. That is, drink lots of coffee and only have one donut for lunch each day for about six months. Let the fat trick your body into thinking it is full. Jarred, eat your hart out! Tim Hortans donuts are about the healthiest food you can get at Saint Mary’s (except for Tim Hortans muffins, but they cost more). If doing lots of chin-ups does not get you to where you can do a one handed chin-up, being 10 pounds under your ideal wight definitely helps.

Being able to pull yourself up with one hand and no footholds, enough that you can get that other hold which is just out of reach, can be a big help at the crux of a problem. I miss that. Now I am 10 pounds (at least) over my ideal weight, so I will be a trad climber until I get rid of the excess baggage. Not that being fit would not be good for trad too, but if you are not fit enough to push your personal limits then trad tends to provide a more fulfilling experience at grades well below your personal best.

Teth
User avatar
The Teth
 
Posts: 453
Joined: Wed Oct 27, 2004 1:01 pm
Location: Halifax

Postby The Mitt » Mon Aug 15, 2005 4:36 pm

Do people just climb for the aesthetics anymore? I have seen many people pass up easier routes and problems that are some of the best lines because they were not of a worthy grade. Why not just go to a beautiful place like dover find some obvious lines and have fun?

I think that one of the reasons people don't Climb in the traditional form anymore is that climbing is being broken down into short powerful moves that can have less of a subjective grade. More power less aesthetics with a shorter duration to complete the route/problem which will result in more problems attempted and completed.

Also Traditional climbing is harder to promote ones self and therefore sees less promotion. Setting up the video camera for the next glory shot is difficult on the second pitch. Granted some people video tape their climbs to share exciting and or long fought experience and yet others have videos to shamelessly self promote. (not a judgement just an opinion) There are people out there who won't do a trip without a cameraman.

At the end of the day I think that people are doing whats most fun for them. I believe that years ago traditional climbing was the sport of outcasts and people on the fringe of society (re. jim bridwell, john long...etc). Now as climbing has evolved into a mainstream and "accepted" sport different people are doing it therefore the sport has evolved into something that it wasn't in the past. Better or worse is really in the eye of the beholder. After all what gets you off is all that really matters isn't it?

Personally I think the only time one is truly wrong is when they judge an aspect of the sport or the people doing it. Just as long as people respect the environment of which we climb. Thats my take on it Sean.


Mitt
User avatar
The Mitt
 
Posts: 847
Joined: Sun Dec 12, 2004 5:22 pm
Location: Prospect NS

Postby Fred » Mon Aug 15, 2005 5:12 pm

I'm working on more route vieos.

I totaly enjoy a nice stroll up a beautifull Trad route. Much more than a nice boulder problem in fact. Which is why I always consider myself a rope climber instead of a boulderer. But I do prefer sport climbing overall.
I want to go to hell... there's probably lots of rock to climb there.
User avatar
Fred
Site Admin
 
Posts: 3140
Joined: Wed Oct 20, 2004 12:30 am
Location: Fredericton, NB

Postby mitchleblanc » Mon Aug 15, 2005 8:57 pm

dcentral wrote:This could also be a quantity vs. quality issue. I'm not commenting on your technique here.

But a 100 in one work out is a lot for most people. If someone can do 20 good ones with no sacrifice in technique ex. swinging from your hips or whatever to get up. Will probably be just as benficial then doing a lot with bad technique.


Yeah, obviously this wasn't real training... I am a 3 sets x 10 reps kind of guy, and doing them properly I can only do about 15 chin-ups per set? That "100 chin-ups per day" thing was more of a silly thing we got onto where we would just chin-up endlessly.. not real training. Just playing, mostly. Form is such a funny thing: I love watching the massive boys in the gym bucking and arching their backs to life weight that is just too heavy.. losers.

Oh, and I wasn't saying training endurance is actually dumb (or that you were dumb for doing it... maybe for enjoying it ;) but not doing it)... when I was rope climbing a bit I was actually bouldering much better.. I was just saying it sucks!

"training is doing what you know you have to do, even when you don't want to" (or something like that).

... no one ever said I was good at training!
User avatar
mitchleblanc
 
Posts: 342
Joined: Wed Oct 20, 2004 12:37 am
Location: Vancouver

Postby granite_grrl » Tue Aug 16, 2005 7:18 am

Its funny, when I started climbing in NS it was with routes. The next summer I tried my hand at bouldering, but it wasn't something that I really took to (probably because I sucked at it). I stayed at the top roping game for a really long time, but to me the next logical progression was to start leading on gear.

I was totally enamoured with trad climbing before I took to bouldering and sport climbing (I enjoyed both, but didn't realize the possible obbsessive nature associated with each).

In my head bouldering wasn't the #1 thing to do in NS...in fact I don't think I realized how popular bouldering really was until I moved away and kept hearing from people "Wow, you're from Nova Scotia? You've ever been to Dover Island??". The bouldering is what people outside of the province knows NS for.

Is it any surprize then that people come to Nova Scotia soley for the bouldering? With most of the gyms set up mostly for bouldering is it a surprize that most people trasition into bouldering when they head out doors?
User avatar
granite_grrl
 
Posts: 925
Joined: Wed Oct 27, 2004 2:56 pm
Location: St. Catharines, ON

Postby martha » Tue Aug 16, 2005 7:29 am

The Mitt wrote:Do people just climb for the aesthetics anymore?


I hear ya.

We are headed to the Gunks in a couple of weeks and pregnant me will be leading as many 5.3 5Star routes as I can get my hands on. Wooot!!

See...If 'It's a Way of Life' went on for 10 pitches it would be the ultimate route......long, beautiful 5.4

I love trad climbing and I love climbing gorgeous routes with nice moves, nice rock and nice views.

I always climb way harder on a rope, either sharp end or second then I do bouldering. I will never be a 'boulderer'...just a traddie.
The phrase "working mother" is redundant. ~Jane Sellman

If a husband speaks in the woods, and his wife is not there to hear him...is he still wrong?
martha
 
Posts: 2105
Joined: Wed Oct 20, 2004 9:40 am
Location: planning the next climbing trip....

Previous

Return to Nova Scotia

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 31 guests

cron